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PostPosted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:01 am 
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I was thinking of having Gemini Customs build my wife a Ruger SP101 for a carry gun minus the porting. I was wondering if anyone has had any experiance with there work. I am also looking at getting her a 1911 in 9mm as well. I think that everyone should have a backup gun, and whats better than a good revolver. Besides, I want to have one, and if I tell her that its for her, I wont hear so much bitching. Tell me what you guys think, Thanks in advance.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 5:32 am 
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Personally, I think the Ruger is a little chunky for a BUG. I prefer (as do most people it seems) a Smith J frame. They come in every metal known to mankind (well, almost!), allowing you to pick a weight that you're (oops! SHE) is most comfortable with. Add in caliber, barrel length, sights, and even butt(!) and you can find something that carries best for you/her.
However, if SHE (or you) just wants a SP101, go for it! Tough guns.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 3:31 am 
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I have no experience with the SP101 as a gun but Marc & Karen at Gemini are awesome people. I had Mark checker a 1911 front strap for me at 25 lpi and he did a fantastic job. The price was very fair and he had it done in the time frame he quoted, which was about 4 weeks.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:05 am 
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dbltap45acp wrote:
I was thinking of having Gemini Customs build my wife a Ruger SP101 for a carry gun minus the porting. I was wondering if anyone has had any experiance with there work. I am also looking at getting her a 1911 in 9mm as well. I think that everyone should have a backup gun, and whats better than a good revolver. Besides, I want to have one, and if I tell her that its for her, I wont hear so much bitching. Tell me what you guys think, Thanks in advance.



Marc is a great guy to deal with, I ordered one of the nighthawk/red-dragon packages 2 weeks ago..i'll let you know when it gets in


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 1:38 pm 
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I sold alot of 101's in my retail days and can't remember ever getting a bad one back. They are on the big side for 5 shooters but that over engineering makes them tough.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 3:22 pm 
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I've got one in 2.5" and I love it.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 6:11 pm 
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I think the SP101 is great for a female or anyone of small size, 2.5" barrel is fine but 3" would be even better. The heavier and hefty gun soaks up recoil and allow quicker follow up shots. Aluminum Smith J frames require much more practice (which most j-frame owners rarely do) and stronger hand grip to control. Get the double action trigger tuned and your SP is good to go. Your decision to skip the porting is wise.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2006 9:17 pm 
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Well, after the opinions of all, I decided to go with the 3 inch Ruger sp101 for the wife and not get the porting. Thanks to everyone who answered, I let her feel the difference between the Ruger and the S&W to see which fits her better and she liked the Ruger better. She sot both and the hevier Ruger was more controlable for her. I will post some pictures in a few months when I get it in for Gemini Customs.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 10, 2006 9:57 pm 
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Marc should be getting close to finishing up my S&W 66 and hopefully I'll have it back in my hands very soon. There have been some delays with parts, SHOT, etc. and it has me so excited I almost can't stand it.

I'll post up pics and reviews when it gets here.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 1:04 am 
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I would love to see some pictures of there work, and I have a S&W 66 that I would love to send out to them.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 5:58 pm 
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smooth one wrote:
Your decision to skip the porting is wise.


Can you elaborate please? Just want to see opinions on why/why not for the porting...thanks


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 6:02 pm 
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Chriso916 wrote:
smooth one wrote:
Your decision to skip the porting is wise.


Can you elaborate please? Just want to see opinions on why/why not for the porting...thanks


I would like also to hear why skipping the porting is 'wise'

I have an SP101 done by Marc, with the porting, does that make me unwise? :?

Please elaborate with facts to why porting is unwise.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 6:33 pm 
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Increased flash and the likelihood of a dose of hot gasses to the face turned me off of ported carry guns.

You shoot that little beastie from retention and I can assure you that you won't do it twice.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 6:37 pm 
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cardboardkiller wrote:
Increased flash and the likelihood of a dose of hot gasses to the face turned me off of ported carry guns.



Increased flash? Not necessarily, this conversation comes up alot. During lit, or even during night time conditions, the Weigland (sp) porting doesnt make more flash, it just makes it a different flash. Both blind you equally. NOT an issue...

Quote:

You shoot that little beastie from retention and I can assure you that you won't do it twice.



I have, more than twice. A simple angle to the right in my strong side....nulls that out..


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 6:43 pm 
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Can you maintain that angle under stress if TSHTF?

If so, I'd hazard a guess that you're better than 99.9% of the CCW'ers out there.

I don't want the tool that I'm relying on to get me through a fight to be the reason I lost the fight.

I'm not condemning anyone's choice to carry a ported gun, but I won't advocate it.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 6:49 pm 
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cardboardkiller wrote:
Can you maintain that angle under stress if TSHTF?


In TSHTF type scenarios, me having some burn marks on my t-shirt or even on my skin are the least of my concerns.

And angling the weapon when I have presented it and going back into the holster, is something that has been ingrained in me since my very first Front Sight class. When I present, and back to the holster, all my pistol presentations angled. It has become muscle memory, just like flipping the safety off as I come on target with a 1911 style platform.

I have shot this weapon alot in low light, and a little less in no light. The porting affects my vision equally as compared to a regular non-ported auto with comparable ammunitions.

Not a problem. :wink:


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 7:30 pm 
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chrome wrote:
cardboardkiller wrote:
Can you maintain that angle under stress if TSHTF?


In TSHTF type scenarios, me having some burn marks on my t-shirt or even on my skin are the least of my concerns.

And angling the weapon when I have presented it and going back into the holster, is something that has been ingrained in me since my very first Front Sight class. When I present, and back to the holster, all my pistol presentations angled. It has become muscle memory, just like flipping the safety off as I come on target with a 1911 style platform.

I have shot this weapon alot in low light, and a little less in no light. The porting affects my vision equally as compared to a regular non-ported auto with comparable ammunitions.

Not a problem. :wink:


If you're cool with it, that's fine.

I don't like the idea of getting jammed up with someone and letting loose a couple of shots and not being able to recover to either effecively escape or continue the fight if need be.

I can tell you for a fact that if I take a face full of hot gas because I can't pull off the perfect draw with the perfect attacker positioning I won't be long for the fight.

I've owned and shot ported rifles and pistols (over my 10 years of CCW and for competition) and the pro of negating some muzzle flip doesn't outweigh the con of being possibly taken out of a fight by my own weapon to me.

To each his own.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 7:50 pm 
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cardboardkiller wrote:
chrome wrote:
cardboardkiller wrote:
Can you maintain that angle under stress if TSHTF?


In TSHTF type scenarios, me having some burn marks on my t-shirt or even on my skin are the least of my concerns.

And angling the weapon when I have presented it and going back into the holster, is something that has been ingrained in me since my very first Front Sight class. When I present, and back to the holster, all my pistol presentations angled. It has become muscle memory, just like flipping the safety off as I come on target with a 1911 style platform.

I have shot this weapon alot in low light, and a little less in no light. The porting affects my vision equally as compared to a regular non-ported auto with comparable ammunitions.

Not a problem. :wink:


If you're cool with it, that's fine.

I don't like the idea of getting jammed up with someone and letting loose a couple of shots and not being able to recover to either effecively escape or continue the fight if need be.

I can tell you for a fact that if I take a face full of hot gas because I can't pull off the perfect draw with the perfect attacker positioning I won't be long for the fight.

I've owned and shot ported rifles and pistols (over my 10 years of CCW and for competition) and the pro of negating some muzzle flip doesn't outweigh the con of being possibly taken out of a fight by my own weapon to me.

To each his own.


Once again, I am not worried about it. The facts that pertain to you and your numerous experiences on your back having hot gas blown in your face by a ported weapon might provide an insight that most might not have. But, the amount of times you have experienced this is unique your situation, your training, and your awareness, not mine or anyone elses, lack there of.

Hot gasses in my face will not prevent me from winning a fight. The only thing that will prevent me from winning a gunfight or a fight in general, is my own mind, and a lack of training. Everything else is moot.

To reiterate, im not worried about it.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2006 2:33 am 
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chrome wrote:
cardboardkiller wrote:
chrome wrote:
cardboardkiller wrote:
Can you maintain that angle under stress if TSHTF?


In TSHTF type scenarios, me having some burn marks on my t-shirt or even on my skin are the least of my concerns.

And angling the weapon when I have presented it and going back into the holster, is something that has been ingrained in me since my very first Front Sight class. When I present, and back to the holster, all my pistol presentations angled. It has become muscle memory, just like flipping the safety off as I come on target with a 1911 style platform.

I have shot this weapon alot in low light, and a little less in no light. The porting affects my vision equally as compared to a regular non-ported auto with comparable ammunitions.

Not a problem. :wink:


If you're cool with it, that's fine.

I don't like the idea of getting jammed up with someone and letting loose a couple of shots and not being able to recover to either effecively escape or continue the fight if need be.

I can tell you for a fact that if I take a face full of hot gas because I can't pull off the perfect draw with the perfect attacker positioning I won't be long for the fight.

I've owned and shot ported rifles and pistols (over my 10 years of CCW and for competition) and the pro of negating some muzzle flip doesn't outweigh the con of being possibly taken out of a fight by my own weapon to me.

To each his own.


Once again, I am not worried about it. The facts that pertain to you and your numerous experiences on your back having hot gas blown in your face by a ported weapon might provide an insight that most might not have. But, the amount of times you have experienced this is unique your situation, your training, and your awareness, not mine or anyone elses, lack there of.

Hot gasses in my face will not prevent me from winning a fight. The only thing that will prevent me from winning a gunfight or a fight in general, is my own mind, and a lack of training. Everything else is moot.

To reiterate, im not worried about it.


To me it seems funny to take on the liability of porting when the same thing can be accomplished with a little forearm excercise and more practice.

To also reiterate, to each his own.

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 Post subject: comps
PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2006 4:30 am 
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Marc does very nice work and is a hell of an easy guy to deal with. I highly reccomend him.

Sounds like the decision has already been made to go without the porting so no need to debate that one.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2006 11:31 am 
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As one who has had Marc do Hybra-Porting and trigger work on two SP101s, both with 2.25" barrels, and who shot them extensively before sending them to Gemini Customs, I can confidently say that:
felt recoil is CONSIDERABLY reduced, muzzle flip is almost nil, there is NO visible flash from the porting holes, and the trigger action is now smooth as silk, compared to before. I've shot them with a high retention (upper pectoral level) one-handed grip and a close-in two handed grip, with NO perceived blast or debris hitting my face, so contrary to what the nay-sayers argue, this type of porting seems to be a viable option on a CCW gun of this sort.

I shoot nothing but .357 Magnum in these guns, BTW. No .38 Specials at all. The Ruger SP101 is quite a beefy little gun and on the heavy side for a "snubby" at 25oz, and I consider it a perfect CCW choice for someone who wants the extra penetration and power of the .357 Magnum in a compact revolver, but "overkill" if you really only intend to use .38 Special loads. (Get a S&W J-frame!)

Best.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2006 11:43 am 
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SAWBONES wrote:
As one who has had Marc do Hybra-Porting and trigger work on two SP101s, both with 2.25" barrels, and who shot them extensively before sending them to Gemini Customs, I can confidently say that:
felt recoil is CONSIDERABLY reduced, muzzle flip is almost nil, there is NO visible flash from the porting holes, and the trigger action is now smooth as silk, compared to before. I've shot them with a high retention (upper pectoral level) one-handed grip and a close-in two handed grip, with NO perceived blast or debris hitting my face, so contrary to what the nay-sayers argue, this type of porting seems to be a viable option on a CCW gun of this sort.

I shoot nothing but .357 Magnum in these guns, BTW. No .38 Specials at all. The Ruger SP101 is quite a beefy little gun and on the heavy side for a "snubby" at 25oz, and I consider it a perfect CCW choice for someone who wants the extra penetration and power of the .357 Magnum in a compact revolver, but "overkill" if you really only intend to use .38 Special loads. (Get a S&W J-frame!)

Best.


Nicely said, and I agree. If the muzzle is so close to your face that you are "worried" about porting, you also that much closer to the muzzle of the firearm where the same amount of "hot gas" will be blown in your face.

I do not see porting as a 'liability', and IMHO, if you do, that is your liability, not mine.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2006 11:54 am 
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SAWBONES wrote:
As one who has had Marc do Hybra-Porting and trigger work on two SP101s, both with 2.25" barrels, and who shot them extensively before sending them to Gemini Customs, I can confidently say that:
felt recoil is CONSIDERABLY reduced, muzzle flip is almost nil, there is NO visible flash from the porting holes, and the trigger action is now smooth as silk, compared to before. I've shot them with a high retention (upper pectoral level) one-handed grip and a close-in two handed grip, with NO perceived blast or debris hitting my face, so contrary to what the nay-sayers argue, this type of porting seems to be a viable option on a CCW gun of this sort.

I shoot nothing but .357 Magnum in these guns, BTW. No .38 Specials at all. The Ruger SP101 is quite a beefy little gun and on the heavy side for a "snubby" at 25oz, and I consider it a perfect CCW choice for someone who wants the extra penetration and power of the .357 Magnum in a compact revolver, but "overkill" if you really only intend to use .38 Special loads. (Get a S&W J-frame!)

Best.


I am considering ordering one of these customs but I'm stuck in between on the porting. Did you practice retention positions without protective eyewear? I just can't see how you wouldn't get a face full of hot gas but my experiences with porting is limited to glocks.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2006 1:55 pm 
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JD8 wrote:
SAWBONES wrote:
As one who has had Marc do Hybra-Porting and trigger work on two SP101s, both with 2.25" barrels, and who shot them extensively before sending them to Gemini Customs, I can confidently say that:
felt recoil is CONSIDERABLY reduced, muzzle flip is almost nil, there is NO visible flash from the porting holes, and the trigger action is now smooth as silk, compared to before. I've shot them with a high retention (upper pectoral level) one-handed grip and a close-in two handed grip, with NO perceived blast or debris hitting my face, so contrary to what the nay-sayers argue, this type of porting seems to be a viable option on a CCW gun of this sort.

I shoot nothing but .357 Magnum in these guns, BTW. No .38 Specials at all. The Ruger SP101 is quite a beefy little gun and on the heavy side for a "snubby" at 25oz, and I consider it a perfect CCW choice for someone who wants the extra penetration and power of the .357 Magnum in a compact revolver, but "overkill" if you really only intend to use .38 Special loads. (Get a S&W J-frame!)

Best.


I am considering ordering one of these customs but I'm stuck in between on the porting. Did you practice retention positions without protective eyewear? I just can't see how you wouldn't get a face full of hot gas but my experiences with porting is limited to glocks.


I have not practiced without eye wear.

But if you think of the dimensions of this situation, if your face is close enough to the revolver to have hot gasses blown on your face by the ports, it is close enough to have hot gasses blown on your face by the muzzle.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2006 3:29 pm 
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I habitually wear eye protection while shooting, as should everyone.
Be that as it may, I've NOT felt any "peppering" or indeed anything at all from the porting while shooting my SP101, nor have I seen any muzzle flash from the porting holes.
No, I haven't shot with the gun held next to my cheek.
No, I haven't shot in complete darkness, just in dim ambient indoor range lighting.

I was originally NOT going to get the Hybra-Porting done, just the trigger work, dehorning, cylinder chamfering, bead blasting, etc. which Marc offers as a package deal.
Marc essentially guaranteed that the porting would work well with no significant downside, and it turns out that he was quite right.*

I've shot other ported guns and noted the issues about flash and debris from ports, but it hasn't happened with the Hybra-Porting on my 2.25" barreled SP101s, and it truly significantly reduces felt recoil and muzzle flip in these guns. Whether it's louder, I can't tell; it was loud to begin with! I've shot all sorts of regular and "+P" .357 Magnum loads with 125-158gr bullets, and even the most potent (my favored load is Buffalo Bore .357 Magnum 158gr JHC) are manageable.

*Obligatory disclaimer when indicating happiness with a commercial enterprise result:
I'm not affiliated with Gemini Customs in any way at all except as a satisfied customer.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2006 9:37 pm 
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chrome wrote:

I have not practiced without eye wear.

But if you think of the dimensions of this situation, if your face is close enough to the revolver to have hot gasses blown on your face by the ports, it is close enough to have hot gasses blown on your face by the muzzle.


Not in a high 2 retention position as the weapon is pointed at a 45degree angle and away and down from your face. Porting on the slide however is perpendicular to your face. The difference is significant seen in a ported glock when practicing this.... however it seems that nobody can relate as to why this particular porting is different. Not trying to be argumentative, I am just considering a revolver platform for carry and these seem to be one of the best choices out there and I'd like to get the porting done but I'm not seeing how it doesn't reflect other problems seen with other ported platforms.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2006 5:07 am 
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JD8 wrote:
chrome wrote:

I have not practiced without eye wear.

But if you think of the dimensions of this situation, if your face is close enough to the revolver to have hot gasses blown on your face by the ports, it is close enough to have hot gasses blown on your face by the muzzle.


Not in a high 2 retention position as the weapon is pointed at a 45degree angle and away and down from your face. Porting on the slide however is perpendicular to your face. The difference is significant seen in a ported glock when practicing this.... however it seems that nobody can relate as to why this particular porting is different. Not trying to be argumentative, I am just considering a revolver platform for carry and these seem to be one of the best choices out there and I'd like to get the porting done but I'm not seeing how it doesn't reflect other problems seen with other ported platforms.



We can "what if" a situation to death. As mentioned previously, the fight will be won or lost with whats between your ears and not some hot gasses that might or might not be blown your face.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2006 8:27 am 
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chrome wrote:

We can "what if" a situation to death. As mentioned previously, the fight will be won or lost with whats between your ears and not some hot gasses that might or might not be blown your face.


Sorry but my "what if" situation is based on reality. Your cliche oversimplification is too dangerous for me to take into account and ignore my previous training. I was tought to train for several possible positions including rentention. Training for perfect scenarios is to ignore the real world IMO and almost every experienced CQC instructor I've seen has reflected the same opinion. You say the gunfight will be won or lost with what is between your ears, well that's EXACTLY why I'm asking.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2006 8:39 am 
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Guys this thread is going to locked or deleted pretty shortly if the people keep talking about tactics. Lets try and keep the thread focused on Marc Morganti's excellent Ruger work.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2006 9:25 am 
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Pete R wrote:
Guys this thread is going to locked or deleted pretty shortly if the people keep talking about tactics.


Things seem to be overthought extensively. Especially when males and firearms are around. :twisted:

I am now beginning to become confused on this gentleman's position now since he said earlier he is considering a revolver for carry (one like the SP101 pictured), w/the porting, but now is arguing against it based on very extreme conditions. But arguing without actually EVER firing this type of revolver with the Weigland (sp?) Porting.

Quote:
Your cliche oversimplification is too dangerous for me to take


That is fine for me. Im not worried about you :wink:


Quote:
Lets try and keep the thread focused on Marc Morganti's excellent Ruger work.


Lets....



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