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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 7:49 am 
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Just thought I'd put this up here, and show an assembly project. Not a lot of custom gunsmithing here, because all that work had been done by the originators. And as time proceeds, this falls more and more into a "retro" build. the Mk 12 was a fill-in-the-gap rifle, meant to provide more firepower than a bolt gun sniper rifle, without the bulk and not needing the range that a 7.62x51 delivered. for the SpecOps teams, who wanted a nearby overwatch who could provide precision fire, this was just the ticket. This one is the Mk 12 Mod 0, the original, and the parts are all from the original makers, save for the barrel. This one is from Bravo, and it is a tack-driver. The handguard assembly (and it is a rubik's cube of an assembly job, no fault of PRI) is from Primary Reflex. The suppressor is from Allen engineering, the guy who made the originals for the guy who sold them to the government.

The later, Mod 1 version used a Knight's handguard, but they had to give up the continuous top rail, something that made scope mounting an awkward location.

This will be in Firearms News some time in the future, the schedule hasn't been settled on yet.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 7:54 pm 
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I've just started collecting parts to build either a Mk 12 clone or semi clone. I will watch for the article.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 29, 2020 7:54 am 
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Those are retro already!? time flies when you're having gun I guess :shock:

That is the one the Mk 262 Mod 1 was developed for, right? Love that vid of one (or something similar) being put to serious use from a rooftop in Iraq.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 29, 2020 11:11 am 
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Yep, that's the ammo, and Black Hills loads it.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 29, 2020 7:29 pm 
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The Mk 262 ammo is also pretty effective out of an M-4, moreso than the M855. Found that out first hand in the 'Stan.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2020 7:03 am 
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I should think so BBBBBill. Any time you want to relate some experiences that might be educational, we're all ears. For now I'll just ask the one question, was Mk262 hard to get for anyone who wasn't a DM? The Ranger in the family, I'm not sure he would know what Mk262 was but he sure gives the new M855A1 good marks after three or four trips. It gets a lot of bad ink but in my own testing and, now, several times testing it in FBI protocol testing, it ain't terrible. Darn sight better than green tips in every application, but when they debuted it as "match accurate" and everyone knew that wasn't gonna pan out, everyone was right.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2020 9:38 am 
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My source for such things (two tours Iraq, two tours 'stan, in SF) reported to me that it was an "all or nothing" thing. either the guy you shot went down like a meteor struck him, or he kept on keeping on as if nothing had happened.

And you never knew which it was going to be.

That doesn't sound to me like something I'd choose over other options.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2020 7:17 pm 
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Ned Christiansen wrote:
I should think so BBBBBill. Any time you want to relate some experiences that might be educational, we're all ears. For now I'll just ask the one question, was Mk262 hard to get for anyone who wasn't a DM? The Ranger in the family, I'm not sure he would know what Mk262 was but he sure gives the new M855A1 good marks after three or four trips. It gets a lot of bad ink but in my own testing and, now, several times testing it in FBI protocol testing, it ain't terrible. Darn sight better than green tips in every application, but when they debuted it as "match accurate" and everyone knew that wasn't gonna pan out, everyone was right.


My job was not Infantry or SF, rather a Civil Affairs team chief (the softer side of SOF :lol: ). We lived with the Afghans when not running ops with Army Infantry, Marines (22nd MEU and 3-6), or SF. Intially we were in Ghazni and began building Fob Ghanzni from the ground up around an old madrasa. We later moved down to Oruzgun Province. Our team house in Oruzgun was a compound on the north side of Tarin Khowt, then controlled by the governor of Oruzgun Province, Jan Mohammed, whom we dealt with almost daily when there. He was corrupt and playing both sides. We had Toyota Hilux pickups and a Range Rover instead of Hummers. Also a team of 9 Afghans, whom I paid with OP fund money, that served as my own PSD. I only trusted the terp and driver as I got them from a 3rd Group ODA that was rotating out who vouched for them. The others were loyal only because of the money, which was far more than they could make from any other source. We covered the area from half way to Kandahar (to the south) to the eastern part of Farah, northern part of Helmand, all of Oruzgun with lots of attention focused on Deh Rawood, all of Daikundi Province, northwestern Zabul Privince, and the weastern/southern half of Ghazni. There was some overlap/mutual support with other teams, but mostly on our own.

The Marines 22nd MEU had FOB Ripley a klick south of Tarin Khowt. 22 MEU was commanded by then COL Frank McKenzie, now the 4 star in command of CENTCOM and a great Marine warrior. I had more fun with the 22nd MEU than anyone else we worked with.

Enough background. I'm getting nostalgic and missing the old days.

So no particular expertise. Just a few engagements and observations. We drew our ammo from SF at Camp Vance in Baghram. To those guys ABL means "another bullet launched" instead of ammunition basic load, so when we showed up it was "How much do you want?", " Need some of this?", and "Here. Try some of this." I had not even heard of the Mk 262 round at that point. Just kind of fell into it by luck. At the time the US footprint in the 'Stan was relatively small, but logistics support was fairly robust, at least for SOF. So plenty of ammo to go around. No issues there. The ammo functioned and zeroed just fine. In the firefights it did the job when called on. From non scientific observations it seemed to put the bad guys down with more authority than the standard M 855 green tip that others were carrying. That was also the observation/opinion of the SF guys I talked to.

I currently favor M-193 equivalent for general tactical range and plinking. I'm curious about the Mk 318 round. No experience with it so far, but from what I have read about the accuracy, I would do better to stick with a Mk 262 equivalent load.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 7:58 am 
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Monte LaClair at Centurion arms has some experience with the mk12 and bit to do with on going development of them if I recall correctly. Think he’s offering parts, info to full mk12 builds if anyone is needing them.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2020 9:29 am 
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Thanks BBBBill and most interesting!

My scant experience with the Mk318 is that yes, for accuracy the Mk262 Mod1 is a much better choice.... I think we have tested Mk318 in our twice-annual FBI protocol testing, I need to revisit for the results.

I think you're right Mark, and in my few dealings with Monty the guy and the stuff have been top-notch.


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