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Hello everyone. I am new to this forum and I am a 1911 enthusiast. I have been lurking for a long time and have made some purchases here so I have dealt with some of you and this place is great. I originally joined because I have a Yost Signature Grade Colt and wanted to find some more info about his work and others. Since then, I have purchase several full house customs from a person who was selling their collection. All of the ones I have purchased from him did not have build sheets or paperwork, but I have no reason to doubt him and most of the makers have been kind enough to communicate with me and confirm that it is indeed their pistol and they are clearly marked. One of them baffles me though and I was hoping that someone could help me confirm the original of what was sold to me as a Liebenberg Colt Commander. I tried emailing Paul with pics and I have not heard back, so while I am waiting, I though I would ask you guys for assistance. I have detail striped the pistol and cannot find any markings that look like a makers mark but the amount of hand work and detail is amazing. Below is a link to my photo album and a photo so if you could take a look, I would appreciate it. It originally had a back plastic trigger which is back in it and the other trigger was dropped in for looks.

http://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i173/ ... Commander/



Thanks and feel free to look at the others!

Chris

Very cool catch !

I have always liked the look of his beavertails.

_________________
No good deed goes unpunished.

At least two features of your pistol appaear to be Liebenberg 'signature items' :
• the grip safety
• the beveled hammer ring

Of the two, the grip safety appears rather more solid proof of origin: As implied by OldLawman in his post above, its profile is characteristic of those Mr. Liebenberg built by hand.

Regarding the beveled hammer ring, many gunsmiths have done this modification. However, this was also one of Mr. Liebenberg's 'standard' touches.

Very nice gun you have there. Hope this helps.

-AC

The beavertail definitely looks like Paul's. You may be better served by calling him at the shop as opposed to waiting on the email response. His shop is about 10 miles from my house and I stop into to say hello, chat about guns, cars and bicycles.......He and Marie are super folks.

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No Piece, No Peace

I have one of Paul Liebenberg 1911's. As the above post stated, his beavertail has a more squared of end to it, very different from anybody else. His front bushings are also very different. Instead of a standard,” pinned", the front sight can be easily moved out from a channel Paul machines into the slide.

However, Paul does excellent work and he can build anything the customer asks. Your build could be a custom order to customer specs. From your photo, I would say the beavertail is not Paul's signature work. Your front bushing looks like it has the upper slant like Paul does, but it is hard to see.

I have been to Paul's shop and I have seen allot of his 1911's. He is absolute one of my favorite builders, along with Yost and CT and a few others. If it is a Paul Liebenberg, you are very lucky to own a Pistol Dynamics 1911!

You are correct, I am going to give him a call next week. I usually try email first because I feel like I am intruding or bothering someone on the phone. After some research, I am 99.9% positive it is one of his older guns. I just picked up a Hoag today also!

Thanks for the info everyone.

Shane

I was an early fan of Liebenburg's work. I still am.
His work as illustrated in American Handgunner over 20 yrs ago was an inspiration.
I disagree on the grip safety. Does not look Liebenburg to me.
Please report back with your discoveries.

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http://www.rogersprecision.com

Chuck Rogers might be right: Here is another 'Liebenberg Commander' for comparison. Notice the profile of the grip safety is similar, but the shape of the 'tail' is not. Then again, this one's a 'comp gun'...

I wonder if the 'tail' on Chris Shane's pistol is shorter and more rounded because it is a 'carry gun' (?).

Will be interesting to find out.

-AC

I called their shop today and spoke to a nice woman who is checking into for me.

Chris

Nothing substantive to add, but you've got some impressive iron in that collection brother. Hope you've got a kid to pass them on to, but if you don't, I'm adoptable!

Thank you.

Chris

I spoke to Paul today at length and he was very helpful. To sum it up, I am still not 100% sure either way, but I do know that it not go through his Pistol Dynamics shop as he checked his records. There are a couple alternative scenarios as to how this pistol came about but he is not 100% sure. It is possible that it is an early version of the Pachmayer Combat Specials that were not marked and used welded colt barrels. It was a long conversation but in the end, I do not know who made this pistol, but it certainly is a fine one.

Chris

All of us gunsmiffs keep records concerning arrival and departure of firearms in our bound books.
I used to keep a copy of every invoice I had ever generated, but after 23 years, the sheer bulk was cumbersome.
I now keep detailed work information only for a few years. Most of the time, if sent detailed pics I can identify my work. If I have the gun in hand, I can always identify my work.
The pics you provided were not adequate for a definitive evaluation.
I'm sure Paul has seen many, many guns through his shops over the years. It is not surprising that the results were ambiguous.
If it runs well and hits where you look, enjoy!

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http://www.rogersprecision.com

Right and he did not rule out the fact that it might be his and as you said, it will be enjoyed either way.

Chris

BTW, he did say that looking at the pics at first he though it was his. After we started to pick it apart, there was some doubt. But to the comments above, he did say most of the pistol looks like his work and parts, such as the grips safety.

Chris

It could also be the work of Les Pittman who worked with Paul at Pachmayr.

To me it looks like early Liebenberg. Thats based on the checkering and reworked Kings beavertail.
Not only that but that is a black pachmayr trigger. Rarely seen on a custom gun of that era unless it was a Pachmayr connected gun.

Just my .02 cents

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"The most effective armor is to keep out of range"-Italian proverb

CHECK OUT MY CUSTOM 1911 BLOG
http://thearsenalofdemocracy.blogspot.com

Yes. Paul said that if it was not him, he could think of two other guys that he work with at Pachmayr that have similar skills and it would be very difficult to tell them apart from that era.

Chris

I only now looked at your other images and got a better look at the beavertail and yes I was mistaken thoough I think that I have seen one like it, likewise the ring hammer. The image below is the backside of my Pachmayr Signature Model. I took this over to Paul's shop when I first got it 8 or so months ago. Paul said that the work looked like Mike LaRocca of LaRocca Gun Works who was at Pachmayr back in the ealry and mid 80's......

Looks similar?

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No Piece, No Peace

Yes, I though the pic was of my pistol. So is yours marked anywhere? Can you tell me what you found out about the gun? Was it made while at Pachmayr?

Thanks,

Chris

Here are a couple of more pics




Yes, made at pachmayr...circa 1982-1985....still trying to get more intel myself.

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No Piece, No Peace

Thanks, at least yours is marked as mine does not have a name on it anywhere. Thanks for the info and I will let you know what I find out.

Chris

It very well could be that someone ordered a pistol without the traditional Pachmayr markings, or it could be a more recent build. Check out Mr. LaRocca's site. http://www.laroccagunworks.com/pachmayr_pistols.shtml

FYI, several pics of this gun are in Bill Wilsons book on the Combat .45 Auto

Is that cool or what?

_________________
"The most effective armor is to keep out of range"-Italian proverb

CHECK OUT MY CUSTOM 1911 BLOG
http://thearsenalofdemocracy.blogspot.com

do you happen to have the title of that book? like to have a copy

The pistol actually appears in "The Combat Auto" and "The Combat .45" both authored by Bill Wilson. A sidebar note to that, the pistol in the book is not one similar to this one, it is THIS one. Same serial number. When I took the pistol to Paul's shop, he estimated that the pistol is worth in the neighborhood of $3500 to $4000 to a serious Pachmayr collector.

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No Piece, No Peace

Maybe Craig Wetstein?