ltwguns.com

Just as I began to drool like Pavlov's hound when I saw a Rita Hayworth photo (If you dont know who she is, I am too old to begin to explain)
I soaked my tee shirt today when I saw the new S&W M#22-4 .45acp revolver.
Does anyone herein have personal experience with having fired one?
It reminds me of the Model #58 .41 mag I carried as a back up weapon. (Departmental rules at the time mandated that I carry the issue Model #36 5 shot 2inch in .38spl, which I did, in an ankle holster. )
My backup was carried in a Seventrees cordovan strong side belt holster. Go figure such governmental logic. Wasn't for years after that I was allowed to carry a personally owned 1911 and later a P35.

Secondarily, if you did acquire one of the new #22-4's, who would you send it to for action/trigger work and who is still alive that makes high quality holsters for man sized wheelies?

Joel Ariel
If someone tells you he is going to kill you,...believe him.

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The mature gentleman sitting quietly in the far corner, sipping Lagavulin and very much enjoying the "Stan Getz's CD.

I have had one for about a month for an article. It shoots well but the front sight is too wide and the stocks don't fit as they should. Easy fixes. For the range day, I put a set of Jerry Miculek stocks on it and it looks great. Ajax also has synthetic ivory that gives it a real retro look.

I spoke with Smith's VP of Operations at the SHOT Show. Smith only produced 1000 of these and 905 were gone as of last week.

Contact Tony at Milt Sparks. He did a really nice HSR rig with some stamping for the article. Check his site for pics.

Don't go far without getting a good demooning tool.

Good shooting........

Rob

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We sleep safely in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm. George Orwell

Joel, You might also check with Lane Raab of CABO holsters. He makes a trick IWB holster for large revolvers that doesn't require you to wear pants 12" larger than your normal size. You can find info at http://www.caboholsters.com Best,

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Don Williams
http://www.theactionworks.com
http://www.ltwguns.com

Allways appreciate the comments of a "rough man". I write like a flower but am also of the same breed. That cannot be helped. Bad upbringing I suppose.
I have more than one Sparks product and am delighted to know that they still do this type of work. Most of my old wheel guns were housed by Tio Sam of ElPaso or Seventrees. My old grip maker Fuzzy Farrant is long gone. My current autos are dressed in Spegels.
I am tempted to go spring and buy the .45acp but in my darkest heart of hearts I hope for a S&W follow on revolver in .45LC. That would better than listening to "Serenity" on the Infinity's or opening some Lagvulin. Well, ....almost.
Thank you for your response.

Joel Ariel

If someone tells you they are going to kill you. Believe them.

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The mature gentleman sitting quietly in the far corner, sipping Lagavulin and very much enjoying the "Stan Getz's CD.

I got one, a couple of weeks ago, and will be shooting it for the first time, tomorrow. Are they done making them? I heard they would continue to do production runs of 200 guns, until demand dropped off. 1000 is as far as it went?
I agree, after some dry-fire, that the front sight is too wide. .100" would be about right. I added a Tyler T-grip to the stock grips, but I may get a set of the Eagle "coke bottles" for it. I have pretty big hands, and need a little more to hang onto. Mixed reports on the trigger, but mine seems pretty good. Not light, but smooth and consistent, which seems to be what's important. I'm waiting on a Don Hume holster, I think it's called the 721OT; FBI-tilt pancake style, with a sweat guard. I'm going to shoot a litle IDPA with it, and see how much fun I have.

Ah yes, I used to have him make grips for my N & K frames back in the '70's. He was located about 10 miles away from me (worked out of his garage) so I could go through his wood collection and pick out the choicest stuff. Good 'ol days....

Don Williams does excellent work on S&W wheelguns.

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Sic Semper Tyrannis

I bought one of the first ones and did an action job on it before I even shot it. Just gently slick-up all the moving parts with a good stone. Next I installed Wolff springs, rebound and main spring but had to take the Wolff main spring out and replace with the stock as I couldn't get reliable ignition. Still a great double action pull.
The front sight had to be lowered as it , and apparently all of them shoot low. No big deal. The grips fit me perfectly and my sample had a very good frame to wood fit.
Nice gun and I'm proud of S&W for listening to us old farts.
Marsh

I have had one for a number of weeks but have only shot it once.......we've been having some winter here. Anyway, mine is one of the first 300 and shoots POA with factory hardball. There have been lots of complaints about shooting low and getting a different sight blade from S&W. The reality seems to be finding the right load for the gun and adapting to what's going on. I hold the front sight above level and all is well. The grips are too thin for me but I sure think they're purdy.

If Marsh likes it you can take that to the bank......he's a 4 inch man!

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Bob

Smiths and 1911s are what it's all about!

My gun is shooting six inches low, and three inches right, at fifteen yards; a bit too much Kentucky "windage" for any practical use. I have a Wondersight on another gun, and may swap it onto the 22.

Joel,
I have the original TRS Revolver in 44 special that rides in a Lou Alessi holster which, like all of Lou's gear, is superb. He had a couple already made up at the time. You might contact him if you still have the need for a good rig.

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Land of the free BECAUSE of the brave!

I just ordered one, serial No. in the 800 range. I'm hoping to escape from the front sight issues the early guns had. Looks like a neat gun though. There's over 40 pages of pretty good discussion and info. over on the S&W forums here:
http://smith-wessonforum.com/groupee/fo ... 105428/p/1

I've got some moon clips and I've started playing with them. It's so fun!
I'm still undecided about what I'm going to use for moon clip holders for field use.

Hey Joel , why would any one have to explain Rita Hayworth , I think it is a federal law, that if you are into 1911 pistols then you have to be versed in the most beautiful women of the 20th century,

Me I went nuts over Maureen O'Hara, and Im only 42, if you can see their ribs they aint women, they're starving.

Barbara Stanwyck, one of the most perfect women of all time. See we do know beauty , and the right firearm. .45 acp in a semi or a revolver.

Never had a wheel gun jam, but I can change mags pretty fast

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US Patent 8453366. Take a look. Now have a nice day..

I shot one last weekend when my local gun store had a S&W rep their demoing guns. Afer I shot it I promptly ordered one. I should have it by this weekend and hopefully can have a range report shortly after. I am curious about a bit lighter double action trigger pull.

I spoke to Ken Chandler, S&W VP for Operations, at SHOT. Anyone who has a problem with their pistol shooting low, or any other problem for that matter, should return it to Smith. They have a great customer service department and attitude.

Rob

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We sleep safely in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm. George Orwell

Rusty Grey is a fine judge of handguns AND of real, non anorexic ladies.
Rita Hayworth was a mind companion of quality but my lust factor always went off the scale with Lizabeth Scott. So cool. So composed. So classy.
A perfect lead in for a later female object d 'art; the smouldering singer Julie London. And for today, Caberet singer Ute Lemper.

To keep this kosher, and to back to shooting iron's, is S&W considering a 45LC version of this revolver? Is the current model convertible, and is it worth the cost to modify? Or is the cylinder too short?

My best to all,
Joel Ariel

"If someone tell you he is going to kill you, ...believe him."

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The mature gentleman sitting quietly in the far corner, sipping Lagavulin and very much enjoying the "Stan Getz's CD.

I picked mine up yesterday. I have not yet had time to shoot it yet and most likely won't have time until next weekend. The next task is to find a holstermaker that is up to the task of crafting a peice of leather for it.

You can't use the .45ACP cylinder since the headspace would be way too wide. You could have a second cylinder in .45 Colt fitted.....maybe even by the Performance Center.

Bob.

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Bob

Smiths and 1911s are what it's all about!

Being fast for an elderly fart; Quick like an arthritic bunny I called the S&W Performance Center and inquired about fitting a .45LC cylinder as a replacement for the .45acp cylinder on the Model-22-4.

The unequivical answer was NO.
Cant be done.
There is no cylinder available from S&W that would make the change possible.

My best bet is going to save my kopeks, groschen, shkalim and won, for a custom job by Bowen.

Eventually I will have a *real* honest to goodness fighting revolver in .45LC, fixed sight with a set of elegant wood stocks, not much different from my old Model 58 (.41 mag). (I DO plan on staying out of fights)

My thanks to all who responded to my questions and musings.


Joel Ariel

"If someone tells you he is going to kill you,.....believe him"

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The mature gentleman sitting quietly in the far corner, sipping Lagavulin and very much enjoying the "Stan Getz's CD.

Very interesting comment from the PC. I am surprised by it since only 2 short yrs. ago S&W made a blue Mountain Gun in .45 Colt. No spare cylinders ehhh? In this day of CNC machine centers, they could, if they wanted to, have one made in minutes.

I have had similarly wrong responses from S&W and sometimes you can perservere if you care enough by calling and emailing until you find a customer oriented person.

Bob.

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Bob

Smiths and 1911s are what it's all about!

Well,...it's this way.
I called the Performance (or non-performance in this instance) Center, and spoke with an alleged "agent". He was bright, appeared to be knowledgable and aware of what I was inquiring about. I specifically mentioned the Mountain Gun (Model-25 ? I think) and he said that it was not a good fit and that others had tried it with a poor result.

I am not up for a fight with a company rep if I have zero dollars invested or if I have no ironware napping in their shop. They are THE company representatives. I have to take their word, and do not preceive that opening a conflict with them over what they can or can not do to be a particularly wise approach.
I politely said thank you, figuratively mounted up and rode into the sunset.
There are always other means of accomplishing a goal, other than the obvious one.
Joel Ariel

"If someone tells you he is going to kill you,.....believe him."

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The mature gentleman sitting quietly in the far corner, sipping Lagavulin and very much enjoying the "Stan Getz's CD.

The 22-4 is, in concept and theory, one of my favorite wheelguns.

In reality, after shooting less than 70 rounds through it, the retro beauty has gone back to S&W. The accuracy was way off. Three inches low and eight inches wide. This was not an ammo issue, but rather a quality control issue. When I took it back to the dealer he peered down the topstrap and said, before I could tell him, "Shooting to the right isn't it?" I affirmed his correct deduction.

Also, I was getting light primer strikes and the "Clinton Lock" decided to engage itself while firing. During firing the trigger went from staging to being ridiculously hard to pull.

I love the concept, hate the finished product right now. S&W called my gun dealer last week, they've had the thing for three weeks now. S&W questioned my dealer about what was happening to my revolver when I was firing it. My dealer told me that it sounded to him like they found something wrong and wanted to know what I had noticed.

I really want this gun to work right and plan to carry it 24/7 when off-duty. This is what a "Carry Piece" should be if it works.

Biker

Can anyone (Don) explain why its necessary for all the 45acp cylinders on S&Ws to have to be so short and leave that gap between frame and cylinder? Why can't they just lengthen the cylinder to fill the frame up?

Or even better build a frame shortened for the 45acp (making moe compact and it sit even better in the hand) since 45acp is here to stay?

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God Bless
45Fundi

I'll take a stab at answering some of these questions. First, 45fundi. I imagine you referring to the distance between the front of the cylinder and the frame. Since the .45ACP cartridge is fairly short, a longer cylinder would create a longer bullet jump to the barrel. A better way to deal with this fact is to use a short(er) cylinder and extend the barrel/forcing cone into the frame window to mate up with the cylinder. This reduces bullet jump distance to the rifling and should give better performance. S&W made a 625 about 5 years ago with a long barrel and short cylinder at the suggestion of Jerry Miculek(I think if IIRC) and I own one of them.

BikerRN.....I have two 22-4s and both with been back to S&W for new front sights. I took them to Thunder Ranch in Sept. 2006 and shot the revolver training course. The gun never hiccupped. You seem to have gotten a "turd" which happens. Stay with it and they will get it fixed. Kate Fredette at S&W has been my lifeline there for years. Some of the people who answer phones at S&W don't know what they're talking about and will tell you bad poop.

Good luck,

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Bob

Smiths and 1911s are what it's all about!

I got my 22-4 back and IT'S A KEEPER!

I shot a mock L.E. Qual Course with mine the day I got it back, pushed the gun hard trying to get it to fail. I'm happy to report that I had no bobbles, glitches or hiccups.

I shot at 25 Yards, 15 Yards, 7 Yards and 3 Yards. When I had to qualify for real I never shot this good. While the gun was back in MA for warranty work I had them "Bob" the Hammer and make it D.A.O. and give it an "Action Job". This was the best money I ever spent on a handgun.

The Trigger and Action on this gun is what a Revolver should feel like now that I've gotten it back. After testing this "Boat Anchor" I have declared it my new EDC. I'm thankful that Clint Smith was able to convince S&W to make this real-world fighting handgun.

Not to toot my own horn, but I shot a 250/250 with plenty of time to spare.

BRAVO and good on ya That gun will shoot for years now! Glad you stuck with it.

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Bob

Smiths and 1911s are what it's all about!