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I have a project in mind and I need your input. I have been loading and using 45 Colt in both single and double actions for many years and have always been disatisfied with how much case goes unused in the Colt. The cartridge is position sensitive with regards to how efficiently the powder burns and the case is much larger than it needs to be. What I would like your input on is whether 45 S&W (aka 45 Schofield) is a more appropriate choice in a DA revolver like a model 25. Ignoring ammo practicality for a moment (whether "service" type loads for the 45 S&W is immaterial, I reload) I want your opinions regarding efficiency and effectiveness of the entire package. The 45 S&W case is .015" shorter than the Colt (cleaner/faster ejection), but I plan on using 250 Keith type lead SWCs as my primary load. Current Colt load is 8.5 of Unique for between 850 and 900 fps.

My concept is to start with a Model 58, mount a barrel from a 1955 Target shortened to 4", mount a non-recessed Model 27 cylinder and have the cylinder bored out to 45 S&W. Mounting a front sight similar to the one on the 58 is not a challenge and will make the package look almost factory in appearance. I'm toying with serrating the backstrap like on Model 25s, 29s and 57s but that is just cosmetics. Fortunately the barrel is a tight .451" so I have potential to make one very accurate gun...if the throats are matched to the bore.

Looking forward to your input.

If you're shortening the .45 Colt to make it more efficient, why not just go right to the .45 ACP? If you don't want to mess around with moon clips, get the chambers reamed for the rims on .45 Auto Rim.

I know for a fact that you can boost a 255 grain SWC up to 900 fps in the ACP case.

Our own Nedmeister built a 58 converted to .45 ACP. A slick carry gun, he was shooting it in an ICORE amtch.

I've considered that and I have it as one of my options. I already load for 45 AR in bullseye. The only change I would need to make is a roll crimp on my dies instead of a taper crimp, but RCBS can do that for me.

I think the 45 ACP would be neat in this I have a shooter grade nickel 58 and have several 41 magnums but only 1 revolver in 45ACP (625 5") It would be a great carry. What powder is used to get the 255 SWC to 900FPS

My 58

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The only place you will find success without hard work is in the dictionary

Hello Keith
My Personal Opinion is you are doing a lot of expensive custom work when S&W has a model that shold handle anything you can Load in it. Keep in Mind the Ruger's are much stronger Loaded to max, althogh it pains me to say that, I think a factory Mountain gun Like mine shown would fit the bill. There is a lot of Meat in the cylinder of the Modern Mountain Guns and they are worth taking a Look at. Regards, Kurt.

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"Yeah, though I walk through the Valley of the Shadow of Death, ... I shall Fear no Evil, as I carry with me My Trusty Loaded S&W"..

Kurt,
You make a strong arguement against doing what I had in mind and frankly I have not decided one way or the other. Please understand that economics is not driving my decision, but I don't like wasting money any more than the next guy. I'll keep the forum up to date as things develop.
Keith

Hello Keith
I just figured it would be a lot more cost effective to play with a current offering. I feel the modern offering is able to withstand the High Pressure due to newer steels and tighter Moleculure structure beeing cutting edge today. I have fired some pretty warm loads through the one shown with no problems. I agree with you the case on a .45 Colt is massive, and Powder dumps Look Like spitting in the ocean for the most part, but other than the new trail boss Powder some are now using, I can't see a powder that could come close to filling this massive case. Unless you Planned on using a Thompson single shot hand gun. Regards, Hammerdown

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"Yeah, though I walk through the Valley of the Shadow of Death, ... I shall Fear no Evil, as I carry with me My Trusty Loaded S&W"..

A 250 @ 850-900 is easily accomplished in either the .45 ACP/AR or the .45 Colt. No need to even worry about pressures, as both are well within the reach of many powders. Just not the fastest ones.

The first loading manual that came to hand was a Vihtavouri. They show a max load of N350 punches a 230 FMJ out the muzzle at 935 fps. With the max pressure just under 21K.

The .45 Colt load is a 250 XTP, again with N350, going 1022fps, but the pressure is (get this!) only 14K!

Pressure is not a problem. Make the blaster the way you want it to be, and be happy.

Here 'tis:

Damm, someone still has those grips.

I wish I'd kept mine.

ML

it;s a 642 on steroids.

Hello
I Like my S&W Model 25-5. It is very accurate and easy to control when shooting the .45 Colt even loaded to maximum.. Regards, Kurt

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"Yeah, though I walk through the Valley of the Shadow of Death, ... I shall Fear no Evil, as I carry with me My Trusty Loaded S&W"..

Kurt, beautiful gun. What are the safest hot loads that you have tried?

Hello Ramptester
I currently am using Tight Group Powder made by Hodgen. I like it because it take very little and it can be used in all my other handgun calibers. I Load 6.3 Grains of it with a 250 Grain Lead semi wad cutter bullet and standard primer. it burns clean and is accurate. Here is the target results at 25 Yds. Regards, Kurt

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"Yeah, though I walk through the Valley of the Shadow of Death, ... I shall Fear no Evil, as I carry with me My Trusty Loaded S&W"..

Hello Keith
Another Option for you is to Locate a World War II Brazillian contract revolver that was designed to Shoot the .45 ACP. If the Throats are too big to suite you you could Take another cylinder from any -N-frame .357 and have it Reamed to give the Throats a nice snug fit. These Brazilian's are starting to circulate again and would be an excellent gun to play with as they have fixed sights. here is one I Picked up recently and it fires the .45 ACP fine with Moon clips. I hope this helps, Kurt

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"Yeah, though I walk through the Valley of the Shadow of Death, ... I shall Fear no Evil, as I carry with me My Trusty Loaded S&W"..

Don't forget the option of taking a 45 ACP cylinder and having Clark custom ream the chambers to accomodate 460 Rowland, basically a lengthened 45 case. It will really heat things up, like 230 gr at 1350fps, and heavier grain bullets work as well.

I like the idea of a tight chambered Schofield in an N frame. Been considering it myself, in fact.

What I had in mind, was a second cylinder (custom chambered) for my S&W 625-6 / .45 Colt MG. Pretty sure it could be done w/ either a 629, or 657 cylinder. Only catch that comes to mind (cost aside), would be both cylinders would have to be equal OAL, w/ the same type of ejector system. 015" longer then current cylinder throats, would pose no problem.

Of course a full custom, dedicated caliber .45SW would have a certain appeal. Might suggest that instead of doing a chop job on a premium price 58, why not sell the 58 ($$$), purchase a nice 4" 28 (for half the money), & use it as a base for your custom?

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Regards - GCF

"Sometimes you make eight - Sometimes you hit dirt"